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| ghostmansd[m] | lkcl, sure with such a format change you can do it simpler. There's no need writing in tasks about using a regex, then. | 07:12 |
|---|---|---|
| ghostmansd[m] | As with underscores: this is again yet another personal opinion not supported by technical rationale. I have no problems with underscores at all, this is perfectly acceptable practice. Calling some practice "irritating" and "unnecessary" is too an extreme wording, you wouldn't perhaps like someone speaking in the same terms about your code. | 07:17 |
| ghostmansd[m] | I'll never get what's the problem with metaclasses and how named tuples solve it, but OK. | 07:19 |
| programmerjake | I'll note that I tend to read text like _x as "x" and just visually remember that it starts with an underscore. | 07:21 |
| ghostmansd[m] | Next time, if you allow the input to be changed that much, please don't mention regexes to avoid wasting my time on making the code with them readable. I changed the part where the comment resides only because I asked whether we need instruction other than for diagnostics; when I got a confirmation we don't need it for other purposes, I allowed the format to be changed. | 07:22 |
| programmerjake | though I'll note that it's standard practice in Python to not rename imports to start with an underscore | 07:22 |
| programmerjake | at least in all the code I've read outside of what ghostmansd wrote | 07:23 |
| programmerjake | (includes plenty of non-libre-soc code) | 07:23 |
| ghostmansd[m] | Most of the time, people don't care about these things, to be honest. | 07:26 |
| ghostmansd[m] | But, unlike "irritating and unnecessary", these are valid points. | 07:27 |
| ghostmansd[m] | And these make sense technically. | 07:27 |
| programmerjake | that's true, though if there are dozens of things that are non-standard, it makes code substantially more difficult to read since people have to think a lot harder about all the non-standard parts and have less mental capacity left for all the important algorithm bits | 07:28 |
| ghostmansd[m] | I don't really defend this idea, I don't care about it that much, but I don't support the way the original statement was done. | 07:29 |
| programmerjake | e.g. try reading COBOL -- it does a bunch of stuff in a non-standard-for-current-programming-languages, which makes it harder to read | 07:30 |
| programmerjake | in a way that's non-standard... | 07:31 |
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| lkcl | ghostmansd[m], sorry: i said *if* you use regex. | 08:07 |
| lkcl | ghostmansd[m]: namedtuples are 2-5 lines (one of which is the import), not 10-20-30-50. | 08:09 |
| lkcl | i'm really sorry folks but i am dealing with domestic abuse (as in: i am being *subjected* to domestic abuse) | 08:10 |
| programmerjake | I'll note I find dataclasses much easier to read since it's a field-per-line rather than all the fields mushed into one really long line without being easily visually distinguishable | 08:11 |
| lkcl | as it is ongoing and systematic it means i cannot "wait until things are nicey-nicey and calm" because that could be years. i am therefore attempting to do code-review as best i can | 08:11 |
| lkcl | please please for god's sake be understanding in that even the "smallest" thing may cause me deep distress | 08:12 |
| lkcl | which in *anyone else* not under the circumstance of being systematically subjected to domestic abuse they would laugh at these things | 08:13 |
| ghostmansd[m] | No they won't. Nobody's laughing. | 08:14 |
| programmerjake | sadness... | 08:14 |
| ghostmansd[m] | This is perfectly understandable. | 08:14 |
| lkcl | programmerjake, when it's important to have comments per field then one-field-per-line is great... | 08:15 |
| lkcl | but it doesn't follow that dataclasses are better than namedtuples *because* the fields are all on one line | 08:15 |
| ghostmansd[m] | This is not the point of dataclasses. :-) | 08:15 |
| lkcl | dataclasses are "better" if you *have* to have the features of the hash (etc) which you described to me some time ago | 08:16 |
| programmerjake | I didn't say they're universally better, I said I find them easier to read | 08:16 |
| ghostmansd[m] | But OK, I see where this is going. | 08:16 |
| ghostmansd[m] | Let's stop this now. | 08:16 |
| lkcl | indeed. other things to do | 08:16 |
| lkcl | i'm really sorry folks | 08:16 |
| programmerjake | that's exactly why I wrote plain_data..since it's basically dataclasses without the type annotations lkcl strongly dislikes | 08:17 |
| lkcl | i didn't want to put that on IRC. | 08:17 |
| ghostmansd[m] | I'm sorry too. | 08:17 |
| lkcl | anyway. | 08:17 |
| lkcl | appreciated ghostmansd[m] | 08:17 |
| ghostmansd[m] | I used wordings which should have been different. Please don't take it personally. | 08:18 |
| lkcl | so please don't take short/curt criticism harshly. | 08:18 |
| lkcl | no, you meant what you said, and i appreciate your honesty - please don't ever stop doing that - i do mean ever | 08:19 |
| ghostmansd[m] | I meant, but the choice of words is important too. | 08:19 |
| programmerjake | lkcl: I'm trying... | 08:19 |
| ghostmansd[m] | Same things can be said differently. | 08:19 |
| lkcl | (but do be mindful that if someone _does_ ever say "stop" that you do respect their wishes) | 08:19 |
| lkcl | programmerjake, i really appreciate that | 08:20 |
| lkcl | ghostmansd[m], everyone gets stressed, you have the absolute inalienable right - we all do - to say how we feel in any given moment | 08:21 |
| programmerjake | yes, but lets please be polite :) people are much more likely to react positively | 08:22 |
| lkcl | a nice goal (for me) to aim for: can i ask you to prompt me on that, if ever you feel it appropriate? | 08:23 |
| programmerjake | ok, I can try... | 08:25 |
| lkcl | ok so with apologies for the abruptness, i pulled over the examples and the list of register files | 08:29 |
| lkcl | and the names of things. fields. | 08:30 |
| lkcl | programmerjake, overflow is a specially-handled keyword/variable in the pseudocode | 08:37 |
| lkcl | just writing it up in https://bugs.libre-soc.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1072 | 08:38 |
| programmerjake | > programmerjake, overflow is a specially-handled keyword/variable in the pseudocode | 08:45 |
| programmerjake | yeah, i know | 08:45 |
| programmerjake | see the comment: https://git.libre-soc.org/?p=openpower-isa.git;a=blob;f=openpower/isa/fpcvt.mdwn;h=d25ba9cde097029494325eb7800306ec1cef9c02;hb=0f21df082b191f27c61de61e1746d842e9685dcf#l191 | 08:46 |
| programmerjake | this is why i specifically mentioned changing it because that is effectively changing the fcvttg spec | 08:48 |
| lkcl | it's probably a good idea to put the same comment on line 189 | 08:54 |
| lkcl | # only active when OE=1 (something like that) | 08:54 |
| programmerjake | imho people can just read the comment which is 2 lines away -- really close | 09:07 |
| lkcl | no, really, it can't | 09:18 |
| lkcl | the code is read in sequential order | 09:18 |
| lkcl | this is a specification | 09:18 |
| lkcl | it has to be exact and no possibility of misunderstanding | 09:19 |
| lkcl | specifications are a pig. | 09:19 |
| programmerjake | if you want it, feel free to add it. imho the comment doesn't need to be duplicated because people don't read only one line of code and ignore everything else | 09:26 |
| lkcl | please add it - you need to get into the habit | 09:27 |
| programmerjake | otherwise the spec would have to have the description mixed with the pseudocode in a logical order instead of being a separate section | 09:28 |
| lkcl | and to break the assumption that i will always be there to fix things that you leave behind | 09:28 |
| lkcl | (which is not fair to impose on me) | 09:28 |
| programmerjake | imho it isn't broken. if you think it is, you can fix it | 09:28 |
| lkcl | (which is why it is in the Charter) | 09:28 |
| lkcl | it's broken, and i've explained why it is broken, and i am expecting you to take that on-board as a "cancellation" of your opinion that it is "not broken" | 09:29 |
| lkcl | put plainly: in the context of a *specification*, your "humble" opinion is invalid and wrong | 09:30 |
| lkcl | in the context of *general programming* you are perfectly correct and i would not raise this at all | 09:30 |
| lkcl | but we are not writing "general programs" | 09:30 |
| programmerjake | well, sorry, i disagree, even taking being a specification into account. | 09:30 |
| lkcl | we are writing a *specification* that *happens* to be written in a programming language | 09:30 |
| lkcl | jacob: please listen. please sort it out. | 09:31 |
| lkcl | i am not going to repeat myself, i have enough to deal with | 09:32 |
| lkcl | it is not ok for you to expect me to pick up after you just because "in your humble opinion" you disagree | 09:32 |
| programmerjake | well, you can't cancel my opinion like that, that's not how that works -- changing my opinion needs a better technical justification. if you want a trivial change like that, you should just do it since it'd take like 30s. or you can wait till later when i'm working on it and i may change it just to make you happy | 09:35 |
| lkcl | i am not asking you to *cancel* your opinion, i am asking you to take into account the fact that i am expecting to get line-by-line reviews from the ISA WG | 09:37 |
| programmerjake | yes, and i fully expect those reviewers to read more than one line at a time and take into account the context, which includes the comment 2 lines away | 09:38 |
| lkcl | programmerjake, please see PM | 09:38 |
| programmerjake | i'll add the comment in the morning | 09:43 |
| programmerjake | ah, thx for the bugzilla comment, will serve as a good reminder | 09:44 |
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| sadoon[m] | Still sick guys so might not join tonight or just stay for a bit | 18:41 |
| programmerjake | hope you feel better! | 18:51 |
| lkcl | sadoon[m], no problem - appreciate it's late | 19:39 |
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| knar | good news I was able to build cavatools, found some bugs in the build(i have raised a PR) not sure if it was just my fault but it now works. (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ | 19:51 |
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| programmerjake | i'll be a few min late for the meeting | 19:58 |
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